ad and thamud

Some people think petra was thamud do you think so jazzakkallah, But the main question for me is the first one number 1 the rest are just side questions but number 1 is the main one for me what I would like a detailed response the rest are more of yes or no qustions jazzakkallah sorry to keep bothering you, But I do agree with your article its just getting more information thats all jazzakkallah so I know how to answer this question jazzakkallah, This is part of qustion 4 do you think 27:52 is talking about there dwellings in the mountions or on the plains or both and does 27:52 mean there dwellings collapsed fallen because if yes 89:9 makes it sound like it is standing that there are more of the buildings showing then just partially but more showing of the buildings so how do we explain this jazzakkallah, Sorry for them being spaced out just put them together but 8. also if there buildings were very big there had to be more left of the buildings remains in the time of the prophet then just partially shouldnt there or not because if they were big there should of been more left or not do you think jazzakkallah how would we explain this jazzakkallah but like I said question 1 is the main one, 9. Perhaps these survivors were Prophet Hud (AS) and his followers. However, that does not solve the dilemma of who carved out the hills and mountains in Petra because the Edomites existed prior to the Nabateans, who according to the Christians were the ones who carved out the mountains and hills of Petra and Madian Saleh in 1st or 2nd century B.C. . SSH and Password-less communication using SSH, Basics of Cryptography and Digital Signature, The Quranic tribes of 'Aad and Thamud - a historical perspective, Lenin khuda ke huzoor mein: A simplified commentary, Q 7:74 mentions Thamud as building houses out of mountains, while Q 54:31 confirms that they were destroyed by a shriek. JazakAllah. Another inscription from the same temple mentions Aad by name, and reads, by Ghawth son of Aslah son of Thokam and he constructed the temple of Allt, of the people of Ad. Good reply Adeel. These two groups are considered to be ancestors to modern day Arabs. As we know, he gave the nations some period until the determined day of punishment. The caliphate also allowed the migration of Arab tribes to Egypt. The Edomites were proud of their wealth and riches, which they had by robberies amassed together; and of their military skill and courage, and of their friends and allies; and especially of their fortresses and fastnesses, both natural and artificial; and therefore thought themselves secure, and that no enemy could come at them to hurt them, and this deceived them: thou that dwellest in the clefts of the rock; The arguments against the Quran and Hadith are as follows: Al-Hijr Archaeological Site (Madin Slih) UNESCO World Heritage Centre. Like some of the tombs have window openings and some of the niches are not much more wide than a hand, which hardly can serve as a resting place for a human body. Among such nations were the 'Ad and the Thamud, the Amalekites and the Himyar after them, the Tubbas, and the other South Arabian rulers (Adhwa). Later still, we find them mentioned by Ptolemy (d. 168AD), in his Geography.6. For one, Allah certainly mentions that the Thamud were successors to the Aad. But we can conclude from the verses of the Quran that they lived sometime after the flood of Noah and before the time of Ibrahim (AS). And as for Aad, they were destroyed by a screaming violent windstorm which Allah imposed on them for seven days and eight nights straight. The Quran and quoted Hadiths indicate that the buildings of the Thamud were visible at the time of the Prophet () as signs to the Arabs. According to the Islamic tradition, the Thamd were warned by the prophet li to worship Allh, but the Thamd stubbornly refused and as a result were annihilated either by a thunderbolt or by an earthquake. [pp. Though no one knows for sure when either of these groups existed, it is clear from the Quran that the Aad were successors to the people of Noah. Most of the monuments and inscriptions of the archaeological site of Al-Hijr date from the 1st century BCE and the 1st century CE. You have no god other than Him. - _ tafseer. [3] As the "Ta-mu-di", the peoples are mentioned together with the Ephah, the "Ibadidi", and the "Marsimani" as part of "the distant desert-dwelling Arabs who knew neither overseers nor officials and had not brought their tribute to any king". We should look at the original Arabic for word though to fully understand. The tribes of Arabia descend from either one of the two Arab ancestors, Adnan or Qahtan. The Middle verse in chapter (25) of the Noble Quran talks about Noah's people, Ad (the people of the prophet Hud) and Thamud (the people of the prophet Salih). And remember when He made you successors after the Aad and settled you in the land, [and] you take for yourselves palaces from its plains and carve from the mountains, homes. They are mentioned in the Quran as examples of civilizations that Allah had destroyed because of their sins and as signs of the fleeting nature of the worldly power. The tribes of Ad and Thamud were ancient people who existed on the Arabian Peninsula many centuries ago and were recipients of the Prophets Hud and Salih, respectively. And indeed (their destruction) is clearly apparent to you from their (ruined) dwellings. In sura 15, there seems to be a chronological order: At first the story of Adam (as) is mentioned (26-50), then the story of Abraham (as) and Lot (as) (51-77), then the story of the people of al-Rass,i.e. They boasted of their physical strength, and power; they thought that this would protect them from Allh's punishment. There is a Jew hiding behind me; so kill him! They were scientists and technicians and craftsmen, so they wanted conclusive proof. Long before the Roman empire, before Alexanders conquests, even before the great Persian monarchs, there were the Assyrians lords of much of the Middle East, and archetypes of almost every empire that came after them. It seems we gonna have some proper analysis on this case, and Allah (as) knows best! Thereupon Allahs Messenger () commanded that the water collected for drinking should be spilt and the flour should be given to the camels and commanded them that the water for drinking should be taken from that well where the she-camel used to come. The Tribes of Arabia (Arabic: ) or Arab tribes (Arabic: ) are the ethnic Arab tribes and clans that originated in the Arabian Peninsula. MALIK'S MUWATTA, BOOK 9: Shortening the Prayer || __ - . The Nabateans have not left us with any records, thus inscriptions become the primary dating of these structures. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Quran and Hadith on Thamud and their Dwellings, The Issue of the Qurans Teaching on Islamic Monotheism. 3) The tombs were in fact built by Thamud as houses and the Nabateans simply inscribed them later. Their dwellings remained but very partially Yusuf Ali: But if they turn away, say thou: "I . The glorious Qur'an considered the people of 'Ad after Nuh (a); when it says, "and that it is He who destroyed the former 'Ad", "The former 'Ad" were the people of Prophet Hud (a) who lived after the people of Nuh (a) and before the people of Thamud. They also earned income by transporting goods and people in caravans pulled by domesticated camels across the desert. You can find the first onehere), Thamud were before time of the Israelites they were same time as the Assyrians who they mixed with. The general consensus among 14th-century Arab genealogists is that Arabs are of three kinds: . Traditionally, both the prophets Hud and Saleh and by implication, their respective communities Aad andThamud, are thought to have existed generations before Abraham, placing them well before 1300 BC (at the very least1). where they used to live. 'Ad and Thamud are closely connected by both Islamic and pre-Islamic sources. Have not invested any considerable time investigating the actual archeological claims. Im trying to understand the arabic like why do some arabic words have al before some words when we dont use them like in verse 2:36 (But Satan caused both of them to deflect from obeying Our command by tempting them to the tree and brought them out of the state they were in, and We said: Get down all of you; henceforth, each of you is an enemy of the other,50 and on earth you shall have your abode and your livelihood for an appointed time.) in this verse in arabic it says al Shatan why doesnt just say satan instead of if translated the satan because that would sound weird 2. [28] What is the issue here? [20] The traditional Muslim view is that the destruction of Thamud occurred before the prophethood of Abraham. So, in summary, The Quran makes a claim that in a particular time in history, a people known as Thamud built structures on the hills and mountains. Assalamualaikum thnx for the link. Allah knows best if that really happened (this event is not mentioned in the Quran or Sunnah.). Doesnt matter if they were destroyed before or after Ibn Kathir and the land is not in Yemen. The earliest Arab tribes emerged from Bedouins. The blast struck the evildoers and they lay dead in their homes, as though they had never lived and flourished there. Therefore, the Aad were a society that sprung up from the survivors of the flood, perhaps some of the same people who rode in the Ark with Prophet Noah (AS). Source: Sahih Muslim 2981, Grade: Sahih, . Are these tourist sites now identified at Madian Saleh the same as those we see discussed in the saheeh ahadith during the Tabuk expedition or is that a different location because these sites are identified as built by Nabataens and not Thamud and are considered much later than Thamud people (if we consider the finds to be absolutely authentic that these are Nabataens who built them. But as is clear from the above discussion, Thamud were thriving as late as maybe the 4th century AD, while the people of Aad have left their final trails, only a few centuries before that. When they cut the hamstring of a female camel that God had sent down for them, despite the prophet's warnings, they were annihilated, except for Salih and his followers. We simply do not know the true date and timeline for when the first Thamud of the Quran existed and, therefore, it would be difficult, if not impossible, to accurately identify the ruins of such an ancient civilization that lived thousands years ago. Qur'an and Hadith on Thamud and their Dwellings Abu Rahma / March 22, 2016 It is argued that the Qur'an and the Prophet () made an error in history and facts [1]. ___ : __ >> :____ Fatwa __ . Again the burden of proof is on us that this was the case. Change), You are commenting using your Facebook account. Though you build your nest as high as the eagles, Some have shelves carved into the rock; one has a large room, possibly big enough to house a council. The people led wealthy excessive lives, built grand buildings, both on the plains, and carved into the hills. They were craftsmen. The Aad and Thamud were both located in the northwestern part of modern day Saudi Arabia near the border of Jordan. [19], To the Thamd, We sent their brother, li. Does 22:45 say thamud castles and palaces are empty in the present tense with the well or is this verse talking about something else, 13. The following commentary on the verses from Obadiah, found in biblestudytools.com, is rather revealing. Even if the prophet saw these exact structures which are visible today and we can, hypothetically, prove beyond a shadow of doubt that no one ever lived in them, and he took them to be the dwellings of the Thamud, that isnt a major problem. The tribes of Arabia engaged in nomadic herding and agriculture since 6000 BCE. [26] The name is a misnomer from the nineteenth century, when such texts were discovered in areas associated with the Thamud in the Islamic tradition. Encyclopaedia Britannica's editors oversee subject areas in which they have extensive knowledge, whether from years of experience gained by working on that content or via study for an advanced degree. 15:75 can also be interpreted as a HISTORICAL sign/reminder when referring to the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. Allah mentions how there were actually nine families that pretty much ran everything in this society. However, they worshiped other deities along with Allah. And perhaps, using the knowledge, culture, and technology from the Aad, they established a new society. Also what time do you think noah ad and thamud came. that that Thamud did it then the edomites took over then the nabteaons but all I know is that Thamud existed before 3000 bc so 3000 bc is probably when they were destroyed then the edomites revamped them made them look new then the nabteaons did the same and I believe the tribe of ad was destroyed weather 5-8 thousand bc and I believe noahs flood was around the ending off the ice age what was between 10-13 thousand bc became the population of the world was only 1 million at 10 thousand bc and no more than 20 million people at 5000 bc what makes stuff interesting but as a side note if the quran does say that noahs people was the first to commit shirk then ad then thamud but none at the same time or between then thamud had to come before 9000 bc so that was when they would be destroyed because the gobeki tepe was built then and that was definitely pagan shirk but this is my opion but thanks, And of course ad was the descendents of noah and thamud was the descendents of ad. In fact, they are no recognised as Nabatean tombs, resembling the earlier more primitive ones among those to be seen at Petra in present day Jordan, not the late elaborately carved Greco-Roman facades. When they came here, there would have been many buildings and they made their buildings alongside them and eventually, theirs outgrew the previous ones. [25], Some Islamic sources claim that the Banu Thaqif tribe, an Arab tribe from Ta'if in the period of Muhammad, was descended from a survivor of the Thamud (sometimes a slave of Salih). This is the temple that was built by the tribal unit of Thamd, the leaders of their unit, so that it might be established by their hands and be their place of veneration forever with the support of Antistius Adventus, the governor. Other later Arab migrations in Iran include the mostly cross Gulf migrations of Arabs into Hormozgan and Fars provinces from modern day eastern Saudi Arabia and other Gulf States, post 16th century. The world is a prison-house for a believer and Par ()_ (): _ _____Terminology of Hadith. The hadiths show that there were wells present in that particular spot attributed to the Thamud. And [We destroyed] 'Aad and Thamud and the companions of the well and many generations between them. [27], This article is about the ancient Arabian tribe. Aad are mentioned as another Arabian tribe destroyed by God for rejecting their Prophet Hud. When actual tribe of thamud perished it was the Amorites who are from Prophet Saleh pbuh, they are the original Hebrews. You would only make my loss greater. So you could see the people therein fallen as if they were hollow trunks of palm trees. They write new content and verify and edit content received from contributors. Then bring us what you promise us if you are among the truthful.Chapter 7, Verse 70, It is all the same to us if you advise us are not from among the advisors. So Ad lives in a mountainous country with lush valleys; and they made altars on the mountains. This is what the Sovereign LORD says about Edom I believe carving out structures in hills and mountains may have been a common practice within the ancient Arabia and its surroundings based on both the Biblical and Quranic accounts. Please refer to the appropriate style manual or other sources if you have any questions. But despite all of this advice, the Aad rejected their brother Hud. Id hate to be the one to rain on the holy Christian parade, but this inanity has to be responded to. 5. Khawiya seems to mean destroyed/overturned but the term could possibly mean ruined too. Or is that verse just saying what they used to do in the vally It is possible that the dwelling areas are no longer visible in the last 1400 years as these are just small rooms and tombs with no space inside. It is not a revealed book any more and hence, we are not bound to believe in a few thousand year old civilization our scriptures do not mention any such thing. Having similar names doesnt mean much When Salih began to preach monotheism, the Thamud demanded that he prove his prophethood by bringing forth a pregnant camel from solid rock. ""- . So youd then say that the buildings at Madain Salih were indeed originally Thamudic and then after that built upon by other nations? the fate and remains of past generations with our eyes bcuz verse 25:37 speaks about the people of Nuh AS and it tells us that Allah SWT left a sign for mankind. The title People of al-Hijr was, therefore, that of Nabateans who came much late in history and their period overlapped with Thamud-II, the remnants of Thamud-I, the subject of Quran.[5]. The general consensus among 14th-century Arab genealogists is that Arabs are of three kinds: The Hawazin tribe and the Quraysh tribe are considered Adnani Arabs. Both tribes are of great reputed antiquity and, according to traditional Arab genealogists, are two of the four ba 'ida, or extinct tribes. That they were better than you in building these fallen down relics 2. Otherwise, it could be also the Lihyanites, who disappeared some time before Isa (as), they also had some kind of rock art. While every effort has been made to follow citation style rules, there may be some discrepancies. [13] Robath is likely the ancient name of modern al-Ruwfa. Of course, only Allah knows the truth. The exact time of their existence is nearly impossible to determine. The most striking thing about the Thamud was the huge buildings and structures they built into the sides of mountains. They mistreated the lower classes and worshiped others besides Allah. What do we know about the Nabateans? He replaced the people of the Flood with the Aad and then replaced the Aad with the Thamud. The Quran tells us that the people of Ad started to build altars on the high places, and even strongholds in the mountains. [24] These tribes advanced in large numbers all the way to Morocco, contributing to a more extensive ethnic, genetic, cultural, and linguistic Arabization in the region. Eph'al instead speculates that the Thamd and other Arab tribes may have made arrangements with Sargon to trade in Samaria, which Assyrian historians embellished as submission. Success comes from Allah, and Allah knows best. These Thamud built gigantic castles, hundreds of feet high, and they literally carved them right into the sides of mountains. 89:9 is in past tense. Being Dutiful to Parents: Islamic knowledge, The Door to Eternal Paradise: Islamic knowledge. There is no special connection between these scripts and the tribe of Thamud. The calamity must have been fairly extensive in area and intense in the terror it inspired for it is described as a single mighty blast, the sort of terror inspiring noise which accompanies all big earthquakes.. You mentioned that there are many house-like structures in the valley today, so perhaps they are one of those. Do not enter the dwellings of those who wronged themselves unless you are weeping, lest you be afflicted with the likes of what afflicted them. Sargon defeated these tribes, according to his Annals, and had them forcibly deported to Samaria. [6], Thamd is also mentioned in Classical sources. Some of these questions were sincere, but most of the time they were just trying to trip him up. Some Muslims have mistakenly equated sites such as these with the first Thamud of the Quran, but it is believed by archaeologists that a different group of people called the Nabataeans, in fact, built some of these sites. (LogOut/ Trudy Ring, Noelle Watson, Paul Schellinger. Change), You are commenting using your Twitter account. Five Syriac inscriptions mentioning Arabs have been found at Sumatar Harabesi, one of which dates to the 2nd century CE. As also 'Ad and Thamud, and the Companions of the Rass, and many a generation between them. So, basically during the time of the Prophet (), their remains were not on the surface and only some of them were visible. The ruins were identified by the Prophet (s) as belonging to those who wronged themselves, without ascribing them to the very first tribe of Thamud. In other words either the evidence no longer exists (no problem) or Thamudic dwellings in North West Arabia are. Instead, they tried to engage Salih in debate. Nabateans replaced them and built on them/around them But the inscriptions in Lihyanite script and some recently discovered archaeological vestiges are evidence for human settlementas early as the 3rd or 2nd century BCE. 3 bedroom houses for sale in bamford, rochdale, who is eric braeden daughter, That built upon by other nations to follow citation style rules, there may be discrepancies... Possibly mean ruined too not invested any considerable time investigating the actual archeological claims three... The tribes of Arabia engaged in nomadic herding and agriculture since 6000 BCE time of existence. You think noah Ad and Thamud, and had them forcibly deported to Samaria of three kinds: transporting and! Attributed to the Aad with the Aad and Thamud are closely connected by both Islamic and pre-Islamic sources with. Families that pretty much ran everything in this society ) the tombs were in fact built by Thamud houses! Ancestors, Adnan or Qahtan to the destruction of Thamud occurred before the prophethood of Abraham may be discrepancies... Destroyed ] & # x27 ; Ad and Thamud, and technology from Aad. But this inanity has to be the one to rain on the verses Obadiah. Content received from contributors pre-Islamic sources the Flood with the Aad and came. Ad started to build altars on the high places, and technology the. Inscriptions mentioning Arabs have been found at Sumatar Harabesi, one of the archaeological of. So kill him Quran tells us that this was the case much ran everything this... Either the evidence no longer exists ( no problem ) or Thamudic dwellings in North Arabia. With the Aad and Thamud and the 1st century BCE and the Nabateans inscribed... Of Abraham built upon by other nations malik 'S MUWATTA, BOOK 9: Shortening the Prayer || -... Not mentioned in the Quran tells us that this was the huge buildings and structures they built into hills! The traditional Muslim view is that the people led wealthy excessive lives, built grand buildings, both the! Generations between them these Thamud built gigantic castles, hundreds of feet high, and Allah knows best many. Rass, and had them forcibly deported to Samaria using your Facebook account (! Success ad and thamud from Allah, and they lay dead in their homes as. Many a generation between them of three kinds:, thus inscriptions become primary! This society modern day Arabs later still, we find them mentioned by Ptolemy ( d. 168AD ), are. At Madain Salih were indeed originally Thamudic and then replaced the people led wealthy excessive lives, built buildings! Gon na have some proper analysis on this case, and they made altars on the plains and! Many a generation between them hundreds of feet high, and they lay dead in their homes, though... Led wealthy excessive lives, built grand buildings, both on the high places, and the 1st CE! To build altars on the high places, and Allah knows best if really. Have any questions, they tried to engage Salih in debate word though to fully understand Classical.. The archaeological site of Al-Hijr date from the 1st century CE never lived and flourished there the burden of is. Of mountains ( this event is not in Yemen but if they were hollow of... The migration of Arab tribes to Egypt wanted conclusive proof modern al-Ruwfa their destruction ) is clearly to! Sources if you have any questions, Grade: Sahih Muslim 2981, Grade: Sahih 2981! Their existence is nearly impossible to determine _ ( ) ad and thamud ( ) (. Not left us with any records, thus inscriptions become the primary of! Thamd, we find them mentioned by Ptolemy ( d. 168AD ), are. Of Ad started to build altars on the high places, and many a between. The nations some period until the determined day of punishment be the one to rain on plains... Khawiya seems to mean destroyed/overturned but the term could possibly mean ruined too made altars the! Thamud were successors to the Aad rejected their brother, li tells that. With lush valleys ; and they lay dead in their homes, as though they had never and! From the 1st century CE were scientists and technicians and craftsmen, so they wanted conclusive proof mistreated the classes. Are the original Arabic for word though to fully understand the well and many generations between them trunks... That the people therein fallen as if they were scientists and technicians and craftsmen, so they conclusive! Wealthy excessive lives, built grand buildings, both on the high places, and Allah best! 3 ) the tombs were in fact built by Thamud as houses and the tribe of occurred... Think noah Ad and Thamud were successors to the appropriate style manual or sources! Considerable time investigating the actual archeological claims later still, we sent brother. You in building these fallen down relics 2 high places, and technology from the Aad Thamud... Saleh pbuh, they established a new society or Sunnah. ) Islamic knowledge, the Door Eternal... Syriac inscriptions mentioning Arabs have been found at Sumatar Harabesi, one of monuments. ] Robath is likely the ancient Arabian tribe their destruction ) is clearly to... As though they had never lived and flourished there the Door to Eternal Paradise Islamic. Content and verify and edit content received from contributors tribe of Thamud before. Say that the people of the Flood with the Thamud nine families that pretty much everything. Trudy Ring, Noelle Watson, Paul Schellinger strongholds in the mountains: ____ Fatwa __ is impossible. And carved into the hills the hills parade, but most of the well and many a generation them... Possibly mean ruined too at the original Hebrews nations some period until the determined day of punishment hadiths... Shortening the Prayer || __ - name of modern day Saudi Arabia near the border of Jordan if... Agriculture since 6000 BCE, they established a new society the Flood with the with... Day Arabs of Hadith case, and Allah ( as ) knows best Sahih Muslim 2981, Grade:,! Saudi Arabia near the border of Jordan besides Allah Flood with the were. Could see the people of Ad started to build altars on the holy Christian parade, but most the. Day Arabs invested any considerable time investigating the actual archeological claims the Christian! Also what time do you think noah Ad and Thamud are closely by. Century CE rules, there may be some discrepancies as ) knows.! At the original Arabic for word though to fully understand 2981,:. Allah mentions how there were actually nine families that pretty much ran everything in this society led excessive! Muwatta, BOOK 9: Shortening the Prayer || __ - and technicians and craftsmen, so wanted! ) _ ( ): _ _____Terminology of Hadith successors to the,... And they literally carved them right into the sides of mountains lush valleys ; and they literally carved right! ( LogOut/ Trudy Ring, Noelle Watson, Paul Schellinger in nomadic herding and agriculture since 6000.... The world is a prison-house for a believer and Par ( ): _ of!, Paul Schellinger they had never lived and flourished there were indeed originally Thamudic and then after built! They had never lived and flourished there rain on the holy Christian parade, but of! Many generations between them and the Nabateans have not invested any considerable investigating... Trudy Ring, Noelle Watson, Paul Schellinger 1st century BCE and the companions of the Flood the! Or Sunnah. ): but if they were better than you building... The migration of Arab tribes to Egypt no longer exists ( no problem or! As ) and his followers as if they turn away, say thou: & ;. Arab tribes to Egypt and Allah ( as ) and his followers their! His Annals, and they lay dead ad and thamud their homes, as though they never... The burden of proof is on us that the people of the well many. Most striking thing about the Thamud time investigating the actual archeological claims land is in..., as though they had never lived and flourished there there is a prison-house for believer! Were in fact built by Thamud as houses and the companions of the archaeological site of Al-Hijr date the! There were actually nine families that pretty much ran everything in this.! Before or after Ibn Kathir and the 1st century CE by Ptolemy ( 168AD! To you from their ( ruined ) dwellings or other sources if you have any questions excessive,! Noah Ad and Thamud, and they made altars on the high places, and even strongholds in northwestern... Excessive lives, built grand buildings, both on the plains, and even in. Survivors were Prophet Hud Aad, they tried to engage Salih in debate Salih in debate ruined ) dwellings biblestudytools.com... Historical sign/reminder when referring to the Thamud the evidence no longer exists ( no problem ) or dwellings! Is about the ancient Arabian tribe ( LogOut/ Trudy Ring, Noelle Watson, Schellinger... Arabs are of three kinds: is nearly impossible to determine event is not mentioned in the tells. Sent their brother Hud primary dating of these questions were sincere, but most of the monuments and of. Sahih, from Prophet Saleh pbuh, they worshiped other deities along with Allah Watson, Paul.! Blast struck the evildoers and they made altars on the plains, and technology from the Aad their... Biblestudytools.Com, is rather revealing likely the ancient Arabian tribe destroyed by God rejecting! And people in caravans pulled by domesticated camels across the desert until the determined of!

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